Out of respect for each member and to protect everyone's privacy we will NOT discuss publicly why ANY ONE was kicked out of the room. That is an issue between the moderator, the member and TT1. If anyone feels that they have been abused by ANY moderator we encourage them to report it to site admin at abuse@truenudists.com. Keep in mind, that we fully document exactly why any one has been kicked out in case TT1 has any questions. If any one has been permanently banned from the chat room or removed from the site, that was a choice made by site admin. Moderators do NOT have that ability.
Ok, this I understand. But I have a question here. How come the same respect for everyone's privacy is not shown when it comes to flagging individuals for alleged profile and picture violations. Ok, I think the process by which one flags somebody for breaking the rules is useful and serves a good purpose on TN. Where I see a problem is when notices are put up in forums such as 'Another Day, Another Flagging 2', their purpose being to bring atttention to an alleged rule breaker so others can flag this individual. This is all fine and good but what about the instances where after the person has been flagged TT1 decides that the person hasnt broken any rules and their pictures remain and no action is taken again this person despite having been flagged multiple times?
What happens then is the person is then branded on this site for having broken a rule when our site administrator has decided that this isn't the case. A forum post is then left up regarding the persons alleged 'offence' forever to be read by other certified readers. Can someone address the issue of privacy in this instance?
This is a very important issue you bring up cesssez, and we see it is not being addressed well. We record the URL's that they post flaggings when we can see and think the pics are in compliance to TT rules, some appear questionable, so we record the URSL's and give it a week or so and if we go back and see that those allegation pictures are still posted we have a more clear interpretation of what TT means as written in the websites guidelines.
Perhaps we will post sometime our collective results so others can see what has been flagged wrongfully and what is in compliance. It is clear some of the mods moderate on others sites as well as here thus some of them might inadvertently use rules from other sites and not be accurate to this sites rules and guidelines, as it is clear the mods are in a refining state as we and TN progress. Posts like yours and ours help the refining process, so keep up posting your concerns they are much needed during this refining process.
Very well said, Jane (#33), Blue #34) and R & B (#36) (Love that last comment :)
________________________________________________________Ok, this I understand. But I have a question here. How come the same respect for everyone's privacy is not shown when it comes to flagging individuals for alleged profile and picture violations. Ok, I think the process by which one flags somebody for breaking the rules is useful and serves a good purpose on TN. Where I see a problem is when notices are put up in forums such as 'Another Day, Another Flagging 2', their purpose being to bring atttention to an alleged rule breaker so others can flag this individual. This is all fine and good but what about the instances where after the person has been flagged TT1 decides that the person hasnt broken any rules and their pictures remain and no action is taken again this person despite having been flagged multiple times? What happens then is the person is then branded on this site for having broken a rule when our site administrator has decided that this isn't the case. A forum post is then left up regarding the persons alleged 'offence' forever to be read by other certified readers. Can someone address the issue of privacy in this instance?
Cess, it's called "freedom of speech"
Bad behaviour, does not attract and encourage respect.
In any case, profiles are anonymous, unless you choose to disclose
your identity.
Imho, the chat room is not as public, as the rest of the site, offences are
usually far more serious and therefore potentially more embarrassing.
It is only fit and proper, that they should be dealt with in private.
With regard to the rest of the site. Where complaints are subjective,
if the picture or alleged offence remains, then it is obvious that TT
does not consider it requires removal. Imho, this is akin to being
found not guilty.
As you know, ... there is always the option to change username or
even create a new profile.
If TT were of the opinion that this practise is undesirable, he would
probably have deleted the "Another Day, Another flagging" thread.
by now, and he continues to have that option.
This is a private site, we all agree to abide by the owners rules and
philosophy. If we disagree, we have the option to complain in writing,
and if not satisfied with the result, are free to leave.
______________________________________________________This is a very important issue you bring up cesssez, and we see it is not being addressed well. We record the URL's that they post flaggings when we can see and think the pics are in compliance to TT rules, some appear questionable, so we record the URSL's and give it a week or so and if we go back and see that those allegation pictures are still posted we have a more clear interpretation of what TT means as written in the websites guidelines. Perhaps we will post sometime our collective results so others can see what has been flagged wrongfully and what is in compliance. It is clear some of the mods moderate on others sites as well as here thus some of them might inadvertently use rules from other sites and not be accurate to this sites rules and guidelines, as it is clear the mods are in a refining state as we and TN progress. Posts like yours and ours help the refining process, so keep up posting your concerns they are much needed during this refining process.
Vic, and/or Jane,
"WRONGFUL FLAGGING" ? ... Now I'M, ...... ROFLMAO.
You are wasting your time.
TT clearly states on his blog:
3000 users!!!
October 23rd, 2008
https://www.truenudists.com/blog/2. Help patrol the site. This is probably the most useful thing any user can do. Pervs creep in when users allow it. If someone is acting sexually or inappropriate please flag their profile. There is also a place to specify what they have done to deserve the flagging. Please use it.
He is clearly asking us to flag, when, IN OUR OPINION, someone is
acting inappropriately.
Therefore, if we think it deserves a flag, it CANNOT be wrong.
Wrongful flagging, is a complete "None Issue" IRRELEVANT.
It is TT who makes the decisions, no one else!
If anyone is insensitive or bloody minded enough to offend the
membership, they run the risk of being flagged, and making an
appearance on the "Another Day, Another flagging" thread.
No doubt the number of flags that a profile gets, helps TT to gauge
the memberships opinion, therefore by bringing an incident to the
members attention, will help in this process, and may even act as a
deterrent.
Some time ago, you flagged a friend of mine and published her name in this forum. This was about two weeks ago. she even replied in the forum to ask what you thought she had done wrong. Anyway, all well and good. You thought there was a violation of rules and you flagged her which you have every right to do and fair enough. But your complaint was not upheld by TT1. And the photo which you deemed as inappropriate still remains on her profile. The profile has not been modified at all. So now it would appear that my friend has broken no rules and done nothing wrong as determined by the site administrator.
I assume you are talking about comment #20, as this is the only one to reply.
In this instance, I'm afraid you are most definitely, very much mistaken.
As stated in the update, she immediately changed her profile pic, and either
deleted or setthe offending oneto "friends only" AND then had the cheek
to ask what she had done wrong.
My response was to ignore her comment and repost the updated. Comment #31.
As to the rest, we will have to agree to disagree.
I stand by my actions. I will of course be guided by TT, should he wish to make his
position known, and listen to anyone who feels they have a justifiable complaint,
I do make mistakes. Interestingly, no one else has complained.
Bunny I have to disagree that "freedom of speech does not apply on a privately owned site" TOTALLY incorrect, freedom of speech applies to everywhere in the free world.
While I agree with most of what you say, on this point you are wrong.
Internet is international by nature, crosses jurisdictions, etc. THIS site happens to be hosted in a "free" country in some part of the "free world" but the same can not be said for ALL of the members, or visitors.
What may well be allowed and acceptable in San Francisco, is not necessarily allowed or acceptable in Singapoor, or Cairo, or Moscow. Free speech does NOT necessarily apply.
In fact, "free speech" is merely an abstract idea codified within the USA, and perhaps a few other jurisdictions, but is not universally applicable the world over. We are still subject to the political restrictions of the jurisdiction where we happen to be at the moment.
Any website is subject to the restrictions of the hosting jurisdiction at a minimum. A privately owned site, such as this one, is much like the owner's living room, and therefore subject to the additional restrictions placed by the owner, reasonable or not, whatever they are.
This owner has imposed certain rules, most of which I've no issue with. That's his option.
THIS owner has decided to empower certain individuals with certain responsibilities, subject to the owner's approval. That one or more of those individuals may or may not act in accord with what you or I think may be apropo in any given situation is irrelevant. That's between the mods and the owner.
This owner has instituted a flagging system. His option, and that's fine. That it may, or may not, encourage behaviour that you or I might see as juvinile is also irrelevant. It's the closest thing to self-police while preventing anarchy as he could come, in his opinion, I suppose.
The bottom line is that, just like in my living room, there is no "free speech."
There are the freedoms that the owner allows. No more, and perhaps less depending on the jurisdiction where you are at the moment. It may or may not be in the "free" world.
I'm sorry mate you are wrong. Once you set up a site on the WWW it is not really "owned" by anyone. When you allow others to join or participate then you accept that they have freedom of speech and a say in the way things operate. That is the fact. Human nature means that people do not like to have someone dictate to them.
No sir !!
The owner remains the owner, and supreme dictator. That the "public" is allowed to visit does not change that.
While it *may* be a bad idea to excessively restrict the exchange of ideas ( as demonstrated by the failure of other sites, and many governments ) it remains the option of the owner.
The owner does not by default relinquish any dictatorial authority, though he does take on the responsibility regardless.
People may not like being dictated to, but they always have the option ( on a web site ) to leave. Poorly managed, the site may not be a success, but that does not change the fact that it *is* the owners option, rightly or wrongly.
Freedom of Speech is going off topic of this thread, but the site owner can set guidelines but the ones here are just to keep it friendly.
In reference to full nudity being allowed in pics but not on cams, it is allowed on cams also. You just have to have your face on cam and nothing sexual.
Thomas
Freedom of Speech is going off topic of this thread, but the site owner can set guidelines but the ones here are just to keep it friendly. In reference to full nudity being allowed in pics but not on cams, it is allowed on cams also. You just have to have your face on cam and nothing sexual. Thomas
And Thomas, as said in rule #2, no crotch shots. The confusion lies in what you just said, and some members wrongly think they can get away with any nude pose as long as their face is somewhere in the distance.
A crotch shot is one where the crotch is the primary focus of the cam. The person's face being closer to cam should not require a tape measure to check, it shoud be clearly a lot farther.
CURT44319 you are certainly able to express your own opinion. In the end I also do not fully agree with you. If you listen to what I am saying it really is about the site being a better place by everyone sharing in the decision making process. The most powerful people in the world are those that share the power and are inclusive in designing and implementing guidelines. Ultimately "owners" are only as successful as their team members. This site will only be as successful as its members. Sharing, understanding, respect and learing to accept each other as valued members of the team will make this a better community. Thank you all.
While the manner in which some seek to express themselves may be a bit acidic, it is hard to argue with the underlying premis.
You and I do not disagree that it may be advisable to consider the input of others, we apparently do disagree that it's mandatory.
We disagree that " The most powerful people in the world are those that share the power and are inclusive in designing and implementing guidelines." but we are in full agreement that "Ultimately "owners" are only as successful as their team members."
On my sites, I AM the supreme dictator, if by no other virtue than the simple fact that it's a short walk to the power plug, and that I, with no consultation from anybody, can simply pull the plug, and the site(s) is/are gone ! That it may be ill advised is another matter entirely.
The most successful companies, governments, web sites, anything really, are not democracies. They are ( as history repeatedly teaches ) benevolent dictatorships.
Decades of experience teaches me ( and you will not change my mind ) that input from all relevant parties is of great value, and probably should be considered, but that ultimately the decisions, and the responsibility for those decisions, rests solely and entirely with the owner, and no one else.
To bring this back on-topic, the owner of this site has realized that the chat room needed some degree of moderation. His decision was to put in place designated moderators. Obviously, that decision was made with months of input from the membership clamoring for moderation. The affects of moderator decisions are immediate, as designed. It may be a good idea for TT1 to review the actions of the designated moderators, and decide to keep, kick, or replace certain mods, but the decision to do so is his alone, not ours collectively, or individually. Perhaps an alternative would be a clarification of certain rules over which there seems to be some discrepancy. He will do so either by action, or inaction. Either way, that decision will be his and his alone, based on whatever input he decides to consider, rightly or wrongly. He DOES remain owner, and supreme dictator, regardless of opinion to the contrary, OR opinion in favor. That's just a simple fact.
Additionally, it remains his, and his alone, *responsibility* to approve, disapprove, clarify, or review the actions and circumstances leading to such actions of the mods, members, and either support them, or take whatever other action he deems appropriate, including none, if he so desires.
Meantime, ours is but to recognize and comply with the rules as they stand, or to advize TT1 through the established means, of a better idea.
It WILL shake out, and the lines will become clear, regardless of anything we do, or don't do. It WILL be inferred from the shake out, the direction this site will take, and what it will be in the future.
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