Why do textiles have preconceived ideas about us and how can we address them?

Obviously, the view that nudism and sex are one and the same is something that the media, and some people within the nudist community, reinforce. We are becoming a more conservative society, including amongst young people. We are an aging community. Having Queensland being so backward, and discriminatory, in its laws does not help. Nudists have never really had lobby groups. The ANF changed nudist to naturist, because nude was seen as being rude. Most people don't know what a naturist is since they confuse it with naturalist. The community, even if it is appropriate to call is such, needs to have a unified message. I don't see nudists in the same class as the gay community yet. There are probably already nudists in parliament, but they aren't ready to come out. The religious right consider nudity to be evil, even though they believe God created man in his own image. So many issues that need to sorted out at the same time.

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@jorgerine:
You are right, too many among the nudist/naturism community are re-enforcing the misconception textiles have of us! So the question is, do we do enough to self-police? how can we do better?
Unfortunately Queensland is indeed decades behind the rest of the world when it comes to acceptance on nudity! which is why I am advocating that we need nudists/ naturists to run for senate at the next election and even create a nudism & naturism party! We need representation...till will generate discussions and education!
Yourself are stating you do not see nudists in the same class as gay....this very comment, seen by textiles, could continue to generate misconceptions. Gay is a sexual tendency of its own right, but has nothing to do with nudism & naturism! although some gays may be either...but that is not the point. Therefore when we refer to nudism & naturism we should refrain from using/ comparing to any sexual preferences.

If there are any nudist / naturists in the government, they cannot presently without the risk to may be lose their job, openly announce it, which is why we need legislative reform on state & federal levels.
in regards to religion considering nudity as evil, I believe you are misguided, as nudity is part of many religions, as listed on my blog vince2021.blogspot.com:
lets look at religions around the world and acceptance of nudity in the past & current society:

Here, where I live, in Australia, it is an offence to deliberately expose your genitalia (nude body) if it may offend someone, who can see you from a public area so if you are naked in your house and people can see you from the street via your windows, you are committing an offence.

Nudity in religion deals with the differing attitudes to nudity and modesty among world religions.

Ancient Greek religion

Hesiod, the writer of the poem Theogony, which describes the origins and genealogies of the Greek gods in Ancient Greek religion, suggested that farmers should "Sow naked, and plough naked, and harvest naked, if you wish to bring in all Demeter's fruits in due season." Demeter is the goddess of the harvest and agriculture, who presided over grains and the fertility of the earth.

Although most ceremony and traditions involve dressing up, often with some preferential attire, certain cultural or religious traditions actually prescribed ritual nudity. For example, ancient Sparta held a yearly celebration from 668 BC called gymnopaedia during which naked youths displayed their athletic and martial skills through the medium of war dancing.

Abrahamic religions

The Abrahamic religions of Judaism, Christianity, and Islam all recount the legend of the Garden of Eden, found in the Hebrew Bible, in which Adam and Eve are unaware of their nakedness until they eat the forbidden fruit of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. After this, they feel ashamed and try to cover themselves with fig leaves.[3] Judaism does not share the Christian association of nakedness with original sin, an aspect integral to the doctrine of redemption and salvation. In Islam the garden is in Paradise, not on Earth.[a] This is to show that women and men should be covered in clothing, for nudity has the stigma of shame attached to it. Each of these religions has its own unique understanding of what is meant to be taught with the recounting of the story of Adam and Eve.

Indian/Dharmic religions

Naga mystics, at the Hindu bathing ceremony of Ardha Kumbh Mela, at Allahabad

In ancient Indian cultures, there was a tradition of extreme asceticism (obviously minoritarian) that included full nudity. This tradition continued from the gymnosophists (philosophers in antiquity) to certain holy men (who may however cover themselves with ashes) in present-day Hindu devotion and in Jainism.

In the 4th century BC, Alexander the Great encountered, in India, wandering groups of naked holy men whom he dubbed the naked philosophers (Gr gymnos: naked; sophist: knowledge). The philosopher Onesicritus investigated their beliefs and lifestyle. Pyrrho the Sceptic was impressed and incorporated nudity into his philosophy. The Gymnosophists were Hindus, but Jain and Ajivika monks practiced nudity as a statement that they had given up all worldly goods.

Hinduism

Philosophical basis

The philosophical basis of nudity arises out of the concept of 'Purushartha' (four ends of human life). 'Purushartha' (Pururtha) are 'Kama' (enjoyment), 'Artha' (wealth), Dharma (virtue) and 'Moksha' (liberation). It is Purushartha which impels a human being towards nudity or any of its related aspect(s) either for spiritual aim or for the aim of enjoyment. Practice of Dharma (virtue) brings good result(s) and non-practice of 'Dharma' leads to negative result(s).

Spiritual basis

In the spiritual aspect of Hinduism nudity symbolizes renunciation ('tyaga' in Hindi) of the highest type. A nude person or deity (for example Kali is a nude deity) denotes one who is devoid of Maya or attachment to the body and one who is an embodiment of infinity. Trailanga Swami, the famous nude saint of India, had given an explanation for nudity in religion in the following words, "Lahiri Mahasaya is like a divine kitten, remaining wherever the Cosmic Mother has placed him. While dutifully playing the part of a worldly man, he has received that perfect Self-realization which I have sought by renouncing everything even my loincloth!"

Material basis

In comparison in the material aspect nudity is considered an art. This view is supported by Sri Aurobindo in his book The Renaissance in India. He says about Hinduism in the book "Its spiritual extremism could not prevent it from fathoming through a long era the life of the senses and its enjoyments, and there too it sought the utmost richness of sensuous detail and the depths and intensities of sensual experience. Yet it is notable that this pursuit of the most opposite extremes never resulted in disorder"Extreme hedonists and materialists like the Charvakas are very candid with regard to pursuing of sensual pleasures. They say, "Marthakamaveva purusharthau" (Riches and pleasure is the summum bonum of life). There is another sloka in support of their view "Anganalingananadijanyam sukhameva purusatha" (The sensual pleasure arising from the embrace of a woman and other objects is the highest good or end). For non-hedonists pursuing kama (sensual pleasures) accompanied with dharma (virtue) can be the highest ideal or goal in life. There is nothing wrong in it.

Occurrence

Some of the famous nude male and female yogi (male and female saints of India) of Hinduism include Lalla Yogishwari (Lalleshwari), Trailanga Swami, Harihar Baba, Tota Puri. Also in the biography of saint Gorakhnath we have reference to nude male and female yogis who had visited the famous Amarnath Temple during medieval period of India.

Among the Hindu religious sects, only the sadhus (monks) of the Nga sect can be seen nude.[49] They usually wear a loin-cloth around their waist, but not always; and usually remain in their Akhara or deep forest or isolation and come out in public only once every four years during Kumbh Mela. They have a very long history and are warrior monks, who usually also carry a talwar (sword), trishul (trident), bhala (javelin) or such weapons, and in medieval times have fought many wars to protect Hindu temples and shrines.

Jainism

In India, Digambara monks reject any form of clothing and practice nudity. Digambara (lit. 'sky clad') is one of the two main sects of Jainism.[38] However, the Shwetambar sect is "white-clad" and their holy statues wear a loin cloth.

New religious movements

Raelians in South Korea

New Gymnosophy Society

The first English naturists adopted the name Gymnosophy as a thinly disguised euphemism for their pastime. The English Gymnosophical Society was formed in 1922 and became the New Gymnosophy Society in 1926; they purchased land at 'Bricket Wood' to become Britain's first nudist colony. One of the first members was Gerald Gardner, who in 1945 established the 'Five Acres Club' nearby, ostensibly as a nudist club, but as a front for Wiccans, as witchcraft was illegal in England until 1951.[citation needed]

Neopaganism

In many modern neopagan religious movements, such as Wicca, social and ritual nudity is (relatively) commonplace. In Wicca, the term skyclad refers to ritual nudity instead of social nudity.

Ralism

In Ralism, nudity is not problematic. Ralists in North America have formed GoTopless.org, which organizes demonstrations in support of topfreedom on the basis of the legal and public attitudes to the gender inequality. GoTopless sponsors an annual "Go Topless Day" protest (also known as "National GoTopless Day", "International Go-Topless Day", etc.) in advocacy for women's right to go topless on gender equality grounds.

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I'm in the USA, but we have the same issues AU does. And I'm a lifelong conservative Christian. Born into a strong anti-nude society, and thoroughly brainwashed to believe nudity is evil, sinful, lust inspiring, etc. I have extensive (but unofficial) education on world history and religious history. I believe and have seen massive evidence that the bible is all accurate history. Physical conclusive proof of most of it's stories have been found in the earth. Which leaves me to believe the few that remain unproven are also true.
Noah's ark was found and positively identified by dozens of obvious points of evidence. So conclusively that Turkey made a national park of the site and built a visitor center. Many other such tales told in the book have been verified by actually evidence. Like the red sea crossing and trek of the Isralites led by Moses through the wilderness. That's all been found. The red sea crossing is littered with ancient chariot parts under water where the Egyptian army drowned, the chariot style dating to just the right timing the bible gives for the scene. The only significant unverifiable story is the garden of Eden, mainly because the flood of Noah's time wiped everything out. (I have reason to believe the original garden of Eden was pulled from earth and saved in the great city out there for Adam and Eve to move back in after they are resurrected)
The validity of Jesus Christ being half human and half divine was also physically verified. A man I knew and met several times was commissioned by God to locate the ancient ark of the covenant and in the process found also the real original crucifixion site of Christ. His dried blood was found in the crack under the cap stone that plugged the cross-hole and lab tested. Found to be male human blood all right. Human mother, but not a human father. Only one big Y chromosome on the fathers side. God only needs one, not 23.

But on the Eden story it's genuine and real life. The Isaiah 20 story is too. And yes it was very common to work naked in fishing and agriculture in those times. Jesus even mentioned it once in a comment talking of something else. Matt 24:18 People often left their clothing home when working in the fields.

But as for the preconceived anti nude concept of the modern world? It's an illusion that got going when people went to wearing clothing too consistently. When Children grow up never acclimating to nudity in common life, as they start to mature their carnal subconscious that generates lust rises and uses the imagination to drive lust onto the body. Then because lust has latched onto the body (ignorant of why it has) people assume that the sight of nudity naturally inspires lust, and that causes the banning of nudity widespread. However since it was the hiding of the body under clothing that caused it to start with, forcing everyone to wear clothes only propagates the lust issue. Setting up a blind cycle of each element propagating the other. Only way out is to recognize the cycle that we get stuck in and break it by dropping the clothing side of the cycle.

But convincing a society brainwashed into thinking nudity automatically excites lust, that they've been hoodwinked by an illusion, is pretty difficult sometimes. I know how shocking it is to discover I've been deceived on the issue all my life. I was shocked tremendously when I discovered the truth of it. I'd been thoroughly brainwashed to believe nudity and sinful lust was synonimous, but also from 13 on suffered a serious lust addiction I could not control and could not figure out where it came from either. So when I finally gave up trying to control it myself and threw the whole mental garbage mess in God's lap, started asking Him to clean up my mine because I could not do it. all of a sudden He shocked me by revealing that it was my mothers clothing agenda that had done it. All I needed to do was go naked a lot and get used to it and the lust would go away. As shocked as I was. I tried it and it worked. I'd always thought nudity inspires lust. How could it alleviate it? That was the exact opposite I'd always thought. But it does, fact of life. Prisons are filled with people who've been raised in a clothed world, their lusts run wild and uncontrollable because of it, they can't control em and it drives them to crime. It's sad and totally unnecessary. We could alleviate a good share of that crime just by dropping the prohibition on nudity and encourage it instead in ordinary life and recreation. And Christianity should be leading out in it. But they got it all backwards in their minds. Not the only thing they got backwards either.

But now what is really exciting about all that proof that the bible is the accurate story of earth history. Is that the promise of the restoration of Eden life in paradise is also valid. And a close examination of the old bible prophecies matched up with history can show a perfect match, and we're almost to the end of it all. And I am seeing an obvious setup going on currently in the world to run those final scenes predicted. So clearly we ain't got much time left. It'll be a whole lot better than we can imagine. Not just one measly little paradise planet to live on either. The survivors will have a whole universe full of them to explore. All inhabited by naked people just as Adam and Eve were made. But without the sin and evil that happened here. Thrilling adventures beyond our wildest imagination are waiting on us. But there's a rough time just ahead of us to get through.

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.But on the Eden story it's genuine and real life. The Isaiah 20 story is too. And yes it was very common to work naked in fishing and agriculture in those times. Jesus even mentioned it once in a comment talking of something else. Matt 24:18 People often left their clothing home when working in the fields..

Also Peter was fishing naked after the resurrection.
Some people believe that Mary Magdeline mistook Jesus for the gardener after the resurrection because he was nude and many gardeners worked that way in that time.
David may have actually been nude when he killed Goliath.
Shepherds quite possibly would have worked nude.
Just before David confronted Goliath, we are told that he took of Saul's armor and tunic, but nothing is said about him putting his own clothing on.

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Education seems the best bet. The trouble is, the "nudity is sin" trope (even among the non-religious), is so ingrained that even intensive education has difficulty breaking through it.

Certainly, nudity and sex are two different things and should not be conflated. However, nudists do have sex. I've encountered nudists who seem to view sex in the same light as textiles view nudity. In a perfect world, and, yes, we're a very long way away from that, both sex and nudity would be acceptable. Just as no one is harmed by seeing a human being, no one is harmed by seeing humans have sex.

If the textile you're involved with enjoys reading, there are several books that may be helpful:

Uncovering the Image
Christian Body
That Famous Fig Leaf
The Freedom of Naturism
Nudity & Christianity
Naked

Perhaps not plop all of them on the person all at once -- maybe one at a time until it takes effect. I've read the first three. Plan to purchase the others.

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As pointed out in above posts, their is many reasons that textiles have these preconceived ideas of what nudism is, and education is a good start though how we as nudist behave is key to chancing those preconceived ideas. We've all seen (if we admit it) individuals been sexual act clothing optional places that are public. One of the key reasons individuals will not accept nudism as 'normal' is that it's sexual. So what is a textile to take when they finally get the nerve to make it to a place, such as a beach, that is clothing optional and find individuals doing sexual acts? Yes, you don't have to look, but it is the individuals responsibility to behave according to the rules/laws of the location, which in most parts of the world does not include public acts that are sexual. Here is the point, do we as nudist take action to educate the individual or do we just stay out of it?

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As pointed out in above posts, their is many reasons that textiles have these preconceived ideas of what nudism is, and education is a good start though how we as nudist behave is key to chancing those preconceived ideas. We've all seen (if we admit it) individuals been sexual act clothing optional places that are public. One of the key reasons individuals will not accept nudism as 'normal' is that it's sexual. So what is a textile to take when they finally get the nerve to make it to a place, such as a beach, that is clothing optional and find individuals doing sexual acts? Yes, you don't have to look, but it is the individuals responsibility to behave according to the rules/laws of the location, which in most parts of the world does not include public acts that are sexual. Here is the point, do we as nudist take action to educate the individual or do we just stay out of it?I think the real issue here is that textiles already associate nudity with sex and see those two as being essentially the same thing. Thus, seeing sexual activities at a clothing-optional place only confirms what they already "know" to be the case -- nudity is sex. But even that is not the real problem. It's not merely that nudity is sex, but rather that sex is bad. If sex is bad, and nudity is sex, then nudity must be bad. I've talked with Christians who feel they must put their god out of their bedrooms when they have sex because they believe sex is sinful or bad.

Even a lot of nudist seem to have that attitude.

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I think a real problem here is that there is a belief that sex for creation of new life is good, but sex simply for pleasure is bad. So, the ultra conservatives cover themselves from neck to ankle to ward off the desire for sex for pleasure. Suggest that nudity can be pleasurable, and nude becomes bad.

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When considering such issues, I often try to reframe the question to how to follow the money.

First, I don't think it's wise to consider the us/them opposition of textiles vs. nudists. I spend most of my time as a textile given my climate and demographics, so does that make me a textile? On the same hand, I've encountered enough prejudice as a single male to not identify as a nudist. However, I agree that there are a lot of misconceptions about people like me who don't place much value in the necessity of pants or keeping genitalia private.

Second, the fear of genitalia and sex is a fear of the creativity and vibrancy of life. If it can be curtailed by sowing the seeds of fear, people can be guided, led and manipulated into compliance and directions from others. There may not be much money associated with pants proclivities, but people who are afraid and are responding to threats against their safety, security and morality are relatively easy to tao for cold, hard cash.

Third, religion can be a means to set people free, but also to imprison them. I see how the church has conflicting views of nudity, and most Christians follow. In my own life, the church as taken my holy spirit from me through shaming and abuse, and leaving it has helped me to restore the joy of salvation (Psalms 51). I don't see the church as all bad or good, but as a divine and deeply flawed institution seeking relevance in both individuals' and society's greatest needs, opportunities and threats. Life continues, pants on/pants off, one day at a time, and it is good.

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no standards or guidelines are provided; and when asked to specify how appropriate behavior is defined, there's a retort that it's common sense, implying that if you need to ask you don't belong.

If you ask to join any members club, like a golf club you are expected to behave like a normal person you dont join with the attitude, what bad behaviour can I get away with here.

Why is it different for you when its a naturist club?

As someone who constantly says old naturism is dying and that a new more libertarian naturism is taking over, why do you continue to shout that the old dying out naturist way wont accept you because you are single and not join one of those new naturist places where the behaviour you advocate for is the norm?

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