A Bad Word For A Good Cause?
So those of us on here prefer not to wear clothes... but if we're going to why not support a good cause in the process?
https://fckh8.com/SchoolLaw/
This website is an internet movement meant to stamp out gay hate and to promote gay rights. They sell clothing and apparel and make some very cheeky videos about current gay issues. The proceeds from the clothing and apparel go to help fund pro-gay legislation. This isn't spam, I make no money from promoting this and the only way they make money is if you go and buy their products. Their goal is simple, to stamp out hate, which I think we all can agree is something we could do with less of.
Also, if you watch the videos there are some adorable children saying fuck and it's just... funny and cute at the same time, as well as some old ladies... a couple drag queens, and of course gay and straight youth.
i'm... sorry but how are they repulsive? Because they say the word (sex) and don't pretend it doesn't exist and because instead of doing what everyone is doing they express themselves how they see fit and in a way that doesn't hurt anyone? One would say nudists are repulsive because they live how they see fit... nude... so should you cover up if you have a public nudist event because you're afraid people will see you as repulsive? This is not "in your face" just because your eye is drawn to it... that's your problem not theirs, don't look at it. If those two in the wigs come up to you and force your face into their thongs... then they're in your face... but this is not that.
Trying to fit yourself into a mold that clearly doesn't fit you doesn't make you a "good gay". It's like saying to be a good black person you need to avoid listening to rap music and certain slang and speech patterns because otherwise you'll be seen as the negative stereotypes we have for being "black". Fighting for acceptance isn't about saying "SEE! I can do everything you do AND be gay" it's about saying "this is what I do as gay and it's no better no worse than what you do as straight". I've gone to a gay pride, and I was amazed at how great people were. Seriously, people were friendly and openly welcoming and you didn't have to come in pink wigs and leather boustierres to get that treatment there were people in everyday summer wear, gay, straight, black, white, male, female, Christian, atheists, and everywhere inbetween. Were there people there looking to gawk and judge? Certainly there were protestors in small numbers... but they were easily outnumbered by the supporters, and that's what matters. The community, not just gays, but the entire city where I was came together in support.
The only one that seems to have a problem with these things are people who believe "my way is the only way". My grandpa only likes people who are white anglo-saxon protestants and smoke pall malls and drink coors beer. Everyone else is out to destroy America. The problem is he's just as wrong as you are. The problem is when you set your mind there's no way of arguing against you because everything you say is warped to fit what you already believed. You can't let your own opinions cloud you to the reality of a situation, and the reality is the pictures you show hurt no one.
i'm... sorry but how are they repulsive? Because they say the word (sex) and don't pretend it doesn't exist and because instead of doing what everyone is doing they express themselves how they see fit and in a way that doesn't hurt anyone?
Dude! You can't be serious ... can you? On the one hand you're asking for the cessation of hatred towards gay people, yet you cannot see what's repulsive about your fellow gays setting up sidewalk stalls to sell anti-christian merchandise that mocks and offends everything I hold dear? How would you feel if I set up a similar stall to sell anti-gay merchandise that mocked and offended your lifestyle? For starters I would be clapped in hancuffs and marched off to a waiting patrol car - so be thankful that you have the law on your side over that! In New Zealand the owners of that anti-religion stall would have their asses hauled into court as well. And you expect me to be sympathetic to your cause? Dude ... wake up!!
Who on earth said these people were gay? He posted a photo of people in a tent... legal vendors. If they are at a pride parade then issue needs to be brought up with those who run the parade I have no problem with someone being offended by those symbols I was focusing on the two men in outfits. I didn't see anything of the sort at the pride I went too... and I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that NiM has never even been to a pride... so to suggests that that image is really a gay one? I've seen people in outfits and wigs, so that I commented on. The other is completely irrelevant even if Christians didn't believe that the only one who can judge sin is God himself. They also sold a "Buddha" which technically isn't a religion at all but is seen in the same way... are you offended for the Buddhists? These people aren't just selling to gays and lesbians if this is indeed a pride event, they are selling their specific merchandise which clearly is about sex toys where you literally fuck religion. This isn't a gay problem, it's a problem you should have with this company itself. So don't "seriously" me, because they also aren't hurting anyone and if you were really offended you'd go and complain about the company, only to discover they are completely within their legal rights.
Equality and acceptance means even the harmless things you disagree with get the same treatment. And a dildo shaped like a cross is pretty harmless... unless there's like napalm on it.
ANYWAY, since I refuse to let this go off topic, AGAIN. FCKH8.COM
...Do you read what you write? Congratulations you had it harder. You walked 10 miles in the snow to go to school when people told you you were better to stay home... how does that translate into someone selling sex toys at the Folsom street fair, which BTW is a leather and bondage event not a gay pride, and two men wearing pink wigs being worthy of hatred and scorn? I mean it's your words "vile, filthy" not mine. I mean tell me, did you stand at Stonewall? How about the other events... did you choose to live in the face of this adversity or did you hide? If you hid you can't say you had the experience. And see but here's the thing... you don't have to prove to me you did these things for me to be right. I don't have to sit here and list off the things that I've experienced for me to be right. You're hatred of these things, pink wigs and cross shaped dildos doesn't help anyone. Whether you like it or not, those men in that photo, those vendors, they have just as much right to equality as you or I or anyone else. They have just as much right to be protected and recognized by law.
Let's talk about another thing here... your statistics. I don't know where you're getting that 98% of Americans are straight according to studies polling people the totals are at least 3-4% gay, lesbian, or bisexual. Beyond that are you suggesting that 98% of Americans are against homosexuality and need "convincing" that it's OK? Bitch if that we're the case we'd still be getting stoned and nothing would be getting introduced to further equality legally. So then... what? Let's just crunch some numbers on Prop 8 shall we? Approximately 13.5M votes were cast in regards to Prop 8 in 2008. The total population of the state of California in 2008 was 36.8M people. Of the 13.5M votes, 7M were cast banning gay marriage, 6.5M were cast supporting gay marriage. Now if we follow the "as California goes, so goes the nation" rhetoric to suggest that California speaks for the general population of the United States, we can safely assume that a little less than half of the voting population supports gay rights, and that approximately 19% of the total population actively supports gay rights. I mean that's still a minority but if we follow the other statistic of only one third of the population voting 19/33 means there's a majority out there to soon be had. Surprisingly, well not to me but probably to you, this happened even though people dressed up in wigs and danced in underwear on floats in parades (one might even suggest some of it happened because of these things). The fact is being visible is the only way you keep people's interest. And if 19% are actively supporting gay rights whereas things like Stonewall were only attended by a small few... clearly someone's doing something right.
so anyway. FCKH8.com looks to advance gay rights by funding pro gay political movements through their retail sales, in hopes that all people not just those we deem acceptable can live better lives even though there are people who think that to be yourself is a vile and ugly thing. I bet if they had been around in 2008 they would have totally supported the Prop 8 opponents, just saying.
And here I was thinking Nudists were non-judgemental people...
There you go ! Thinking again. :)Who cares if there are people who like to dress up? If they feel happy let them! Should I go make fun of people who dress up for carnaval?
How about people who choose to not dress at all, in anything ?
Pretty much the same thing, isn't it ?Times have changed, the younger generation of today doesn't think the same as for example the people who were young in the seventies.
I thought that, too. Turns out many of us have been exactly where you "younger generation" are today.
It tends to make us one of two things. Intollerant of the foolishness exhibited, because we are ashamed, or regret that we thought and did *exactly* the very same things, OR it makes us very tollerant, because we have fond memories that we thought and did exactly the very same things !I believe in respect, but it has to work both ways. If the younger generation should respect the older so should the older generation respect the younger.
Respect is earned. Matters not whether one is older, or younger. By your actions you earn either respect, or disdane. That choice is yours.
The problem only manifests when one has earned disdane, and complains that they are not getting respect.Is for example a driver of let's say 50 years old more experienced when he drove his whole life on empty country roads than for example a younger driver who has constantly been in heavy traffic and crowded cities?
Depends on how one drove back then. ;)
It'snot surprising to some of us that one of your years can exhibit so much more wisdom than some of us twice or thrice your age.
As I've said professionally some times....
Some have 30 years experience. Others have 1 year, 30 times.What I'm saying here is that, whether or not you like the intention of this cause, please don't turn this thread into a negative one because there are already so many of those...
And on that point, you have more support than you can possibly know !!
To the boychild: you sorry little twink, you're out of your depth. You are immune to the facts and the truth. You are part of the reason why the situation exists that your "movement" purports to address. Ergo your promoting that ludicrous feel-good scheme to part fools from their money is arrant hypocrisy. Cocky ingrate, you mock and ridicule those who went before you and who won the battles that provided you with the safety and security that you take for granted. You abuse the freedom that they bought for you. And you smear your shit on their faces by defending the excesses that are undoing everything that they accomplished. You are NOT part of the solution. You are a parasite living off of the labors and trials and tribulations of those that you so casually dismiss. You, insufferable little twink, are not worthy to lick the soles of their shoes.Prattling twink, you have nulled your credibility here. The next time you are called "fag" by some disgusted straight, remember that it's what you want.
The only one showing their lack of credibility is the one who can't sufficiently argue despite their "increased wisdom and experience". Doesn't do you a lot of good if you don't actually use it. Respect is earned... you've clearly earned my respect, I mean I always respect those who instead of focusing on an issue focus on the players. I've talked about a few things... I asked you direct questions. Where is your earned right to be superior? Where's your experience? Tell me, I mean if it's so important to you and you think you've earned the right to be this acidic judgmental asshole... then you should have no problem listing your credentials? Really... you mentioned Stonewall... were YOU there? How about these pride parades, do YOU go and try to change the face of them so that the gay community is better reflected? Where are your experiences? Have you ever been arrested for being gay? How about chased out of a town? Or is all your suffering simply you afraid to be who you are because of the potential social consequences? Basically, is it something deemed respectable because others put it on you, or is it something deemed pathetic because you put it on yourself?
You speak of a disregard for what those before my generation have done... how is exercising my gained rights and living free as I am whether that mains I walk around in a gold dress or a pair of blue jeans or nothing at all, a disregard? I'm exercising the freedoms that were fought for, that doesn't mean I'm going to stop some random person who look like they might have been at a Vietnam War protest and say "thank you". You don't support a cause for the thanks, you support it because it's right. "I'm a part of a reason for the cause" well you're right about that. By living openly and demanding people tolerate my lifestyle even if they disagree with it I'm definitely a part of the cause. There are always going to be naysayers, the KKK will always exist, but if you don't stand up against the hatred the hate will win because they won't stop.
Love me or hate me, you got to put up with me because I'm not going anywhere, and neither are the people in these "vile" pictures you post, and the law is on my side... so you don't have to like it. But don't make this about me, if you really believe that gay rights are worth fighting for... why are you focusing on what you consider to be negative? I would almost say you have these pictures saved on your computer so you can just click them up and go "SEE"... if that's where the attention is given why not give your attention to what you consider an appropriate gay life? I mean really, show me the gay community living seamlessly in the world. What? You mean not all companies provide same sex benefits yet? You mean gay adoption is still harder than straight? You mean DADT is still on the books and can at anytime be reinstated as an acceptable military policy? You mean GLBT youth are still committing suicide because they don't feel like they have the support they need and they're still getting harassed and tormented? Well, maybe if we all just go away that will all stop... that's what you're saying right now.
There was a time when a woman couldn't leave the house if not escorted by a male, women defied that and said "I can do anything you can do" and fought against it. Even though women weren't allowed to vote, they did anyway. For a woman to even wear a pair of pants it was seen as unwholesome and wrong. And all women were trying to say was "I was born different, that doesn't make me less than" and that's all people are trying to say now. You can't say that by pretending to be just like straight people. This is about civil rights, not just for people who think like you do but for all people. I can't say "I'm different, but still OK" if I conform to someone else' mold of what it means for me to be gay.
You are no less gay because you're a judgmental sod who's old as fuck. I'm no less gay because I could care less that you're offended by harmless things. I'm no less gay because I didn't go to pride in full drag. I'm no more gay because I went in a pair of running shorts and nothing else. I am gay because I have a same sex attraction, everything else is just coincidental, but there's nothing wrong with it, and that's where the issue lies. If I go to pride tomorrow, which I am, but I go in a giant chicken suit, I'm no more and no less a supporter of gay rights than if I go in jeans and a tshirt. If I sell vibrators with Hillary Clinton's face on them I'm no less and no more a supporter of gay rights. What makes me a supporter of gay rights is coming out to events where we stand up for them, like a pride, or donating to the Trevor Project, or ordering shirts from a website meant to stamp out gay hate and support pro-gay legislation, or even doing things like openly living my life despite people's opposition to it. No, it may not get me killed anymore, but it's still a supportive measure.
Fuck you and your hate, and anyone in the market for a reasonably priced tshirt who happens to feel the same way and wishes to support pro-gay legislation (and look good doing it) should check out FCKH8.com
How about stopping making this personal. (all of you?) As adults, we have opinions, agree or disagree, but at least respect the opinions of others, like them or not. This whole back and forth on this subject, that got way laid, should stop, as all the name calling and such is not a way to respect anyone. sounds like a bunch of 10 year olds trying to make everyone agree with one side only. That does go for both sides of this. The whole reason was to promote one thing only. Did that get lost in all this????? Shessssh. (Oh, i guess that is my opinion, lol)
i'm... sorry but how are they repulsive? Because they say the word (sex) and don't pretend it doesn't exist and because instead of doing what everyone is doing they express themselves how they see fit and in a way that doesn't hurt anyone? One would say nudists are repulsive because they live how they see fit... nude... so should you cover up if you have a public nudist event because you're afraid people will see you as repulsive? This is not "in your face" just because your eye is drawn to it... that's your problem not theirs, don't look at it. If those two in the wigs come up to you and force your face into their thongs... then they're in your face... but this is not that. Trying to fit yourself into a mold that clearly doesn't fit you doesn't make you a "good gay". It's like saying to be a good black person you need to avoid listening to rap music and certain slang and speech patterns because otherwise you'll be seen as the negative stereotypes we have for being "black". Fighting for acceptance isn't about saying "SEE! I can do everything you do AND be gay" it's about saying "this is what I do as gay and it's no better no worse than what you do as straight". I've gone to a gay pride, and I was amazed at how great people were. Seriously, people were friendly and openly welcoming and you didn't have to come in pink wigs and leather boustierres to get that treatment there were people in everyday summer wear, gay, straight, black, white, male, female, Christian, atheists, and everywhere inbetween. Were there people there looking to gawk and judge? Certainly there were protestors in small numbers... but they were easily outnumbered by the supporters, and that's what matters. The community, not just gays, but the entire city where I was came together in support. The only one that seems to have a problem with these things are people who believe "my way is the only way". My grandpa only likes people who are white anglo-saxon protestants and smoke pall malls and drink coors beer. Everyone else is out to destroy America. The problem is he's just as wrong as you are. The problem is when you set your mind there's no way of arguing against you because everything you say is warped to fit what you already believed. You can't let your own opinions cloud you to the reality of a situation, and the reality is the pictures you show hurt no one.
Don't waste your intellect, sadly,we all know where it will go!!
And so it did.
Nah, the twink isn't worth it.
You know after a certain point you think you'd stop on your own... I seem to remember you mentioning something about how bringing up Naziism in a thread in your mind ended it and admitted defeat. Well, I disagree, and since you already think you've won and that you're superior I'm going to do this from now on when I see you just to stop you... ready?
NAZI
there, feel superior and go away. If nothing else follow your own rules, thread is dead and defeat has been admitted.
For the rest though, if you feel like supporting a good cause, or even in engaging in rational debate (have you noticed he hardly ever actually deals with the topic at hand, he just deflects it away like nothing was ever said) then you should definitely stop by this site and participate in this thread.
Nah, the twink isn't worth it.
Yeah, his childish repetitive rantings of anarchism are just to boring to read, so bye-bye, bi-boy.
Then what on earth are you commenting about? You read nothing so... how can you talk about it?
FCKH8.com for those that haven't seen it yet. Great site that's raised 250,000 dollars already in donations for charities specializing in suicide prevention, and that is currently raising money up to 25,000.00 where all you have to do is like the link on facebook and share it on twitter. Shirts are made of organic cotton by American Apparel. Get your cause on. They also sell hoodies, underwear, stickers and buttons, and the proceeds go to support amazing charities like the Trevor Project and local political activism groups raising awareness for gay rights. The motto of the site is simple, hate all you want, we're basically going to ignore you and promote a good thing anyway.
Thing is NiMA, YOU NEED a lession in how to make a rational argument. You have produced a 'definition' of experience or whatever but without referencing it, it might just as well have come from the Micky Mouse encyclopedia of all things NiMA!!
Thing is NiMA, you might have once been a Sparky, and on the subject of electrical wiring and stuff I would certainly take heed of your experience because its not my area of any real knowledge. What I do have is a degree and experience in sociology, which as you may know is the study of societies and how people make them work. Other people have other skills and knowledge. I respect your expertise in electrics, its not too much to ask that you respect others knowledge in other areas. In the real world 'knowledge' has to be referenced so that it can be verified. Otherwise its just opinion. You wouldn't stick your screwdriver in an electrical socket without verifying that the power was off, now would you?!
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